What kind of gun should I get?

Posted: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:57 pm

I get this question a lot:

"Gee, Scott, you're such a gun nut, what's the best kind of gun?"

Glock 17.

There it is. Enjoy.

See, what most people don't realize is that "what's the best kind..." is an "I don't know anything," kind of question. And the answer is not one singular choice. If someone asked me, "What's the best sidearm for PAA use?" The answer would be the Glock 17.

If someone asked me, "What's your favorite duty pistol?" The answer would again be the Glock 17.

If someone asked me, "What's your favorite full-size carry gun?" The answer would be, "Glock 17 or Glock 37, but probably the 17."

And if someone asks me, "What's the best gun?" I usually answer, "For what?"

There's a cheap-and-dirty survival gun buying guide in the Public Discussion areas, with long explanations about the hows and whys for people who are totally gun-un-savvy.

For those who have a little knowledge (a dangerous thing) and who are trying to pick my brain to see where I stand, I'll save you some time:

I stand on the side of reliability, simplicity, ease of use and maintenance, and of commonality of caliber and the best of those criteria in my limited experience.

Glock 17.

It's my opinion. It's my final argument to the "Ford vs. Chevy" debate between all of the top-end 9mm handguns.

Glock 17.

Want to know why? Log in and ask me. If you don't want to know why, just go buy a Glock 17 and a few full-capacity 17-round magazines, a couple boxes of your particular flavor of projectile in 9mm parabellum, and call it a job well done.

Want to carry it? Buy a holster.

What's the best holster?

Sullivan's on Nebraska Ave. in Tampa. Go buy it from Mr. Gutcher. He'll steer you right.

There ya go.

S

Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 10:35 pm

Actually, it's a little more complicated than that. This is an excellent place to repost the Quick N Dirty Gun Buying Guide.

S

Posted: Sun Dec 07, 2008 10:37 pm

From "Weapons and Firearms For Survival" in the Public Discussion Forum:

All well and good, but what about those who can't AFFORD a gun? Or don't know where or how to buy one and don't want to get ripped off?

"Yeah, six hundred bucks is a really good deal on that Used Glock!"

No. No it isn't. However, if your sources are this place and only this place, you just might be SOL.

Given that firearms are EXPENSIVE investments, and given that they may be a necessity when nothing else will do, it is of utmost importance that you, the consumer, get the very best information when choosing to purchase a firearm.

This guide assumes that you are not a shooter, have never been a shooter, in fact, probably never even considered purchasing a firearm until something recently happened to change your mind. You may find yourself struggling with feelings of conflict, even guilt, as you prepare to join the ranks of those you once ridiculed.

As much as I'd like to tell you, "Fuck off and die, asshole, for shitting on me the entire time before coming to enlightenment and heaping derision on me for coming to a conclusion sooner than you," I won't. Instead, I will suck it up and say, "Welcome to the fold."

With that, this guide must also assume that there is no TIME to go to the range and try out a bunch of different firearms for a perfect fit. The shit is about to hit the fan, or it has already hit the fan, and you need a gun NOW. WHAT TO BUY? WHAT TO BUY?

This guide is not intended to be a comprehensive buying guide, with some kind of expert-level wisdom immediately impartable to the untrained novice; Instead, this is a quick-and-dirty buying guide for people who need a weapon fast and don't have time to do anything but actually buy the gun.

That being said, you must understand that mere possession of a firearm will not make you a gunfighter. It will only give you a CHANCE to save your life, and honestly, not a very good one; But it's a chance that you would NOT HAVE HAD if you didn't own the firearm.

Enough with the preaching. On with the guide.

1) Know what the local police carry. If you have the option, purchase what they have.

Here's why:
Law enforcement is required to be armed. Law enforcement has a very diverse array of personnel working at the department, yet for logistical reasons, their weapons are typically standardized. It's as close to a "one size fits all" as is practicable in the area. Thus, the local constabulary has already done the hard work for you in finding a firearm that is both acceptably reliable for defensive work, and fits the most number of people's hands.

If you are purchasing this firearm during or just before a Scenario 1 or 2, it behooves you to realize that you probably don't have enough money to buy the requisite 500 rounds of reserve ammunition you might need should commercial channels be disrupted. Understand that there will be violence occurring (which is, ostensibly, why you are purchasing the firearm, so you will not become a victim) and that many of the front-line rank-and-file law enforcement officers will, unfortunately, become casualties during this violence. If and when this occurs, they will no longer need their ammunition; Should the ammunition in magazines be intact, you will be able to use it, and them, in your own firearm. Also, and while this may be distasteful it is a fact of life, if you stumble across someone who has scavenged from a cop and can bargain with them, or, worst case scenario, have to kill them, the ammo and magazines you recover will be compatible with your firearm. For the novice who knows nothing of caliber and brand, this is a godsend. It pretty much guarantees that on the street, at least a percentage of the magazines and ammo you recover will work in your own gun. Not quite as convenient as a video game, but hey, this is real life.

If for some reason you find yourself on the right side of the law, side-by-side with a law enforcement officer, the ammo and magazine compatibility will allow you to feed the gun of a more experienced and effective shooter (the cop), or allow for a magazine pass should your gun go dry.

In short, choosing the sidearm the police carry allows you several critical advantages you should most absolutely consider.

2) If you can't get what the police carry, for either cost or availability reasons, your next-best choice will be something in 9-millimeter. (9mm).

I love this part. This is where I get to show off my gun knowledge and give you newbies a taste of why you're reading this guide to begin with:

By 9mm I mean the caliber that is commonly known as: 9 millimeter Parabellum, 9 millimeter Luger, 9 millimeter NATO, 9x19, or 9mm Auto. All of these designations are merely different names for the same cartridge (what most folks call "the bullets"). This DIFFERS from calibers such as 9mm largo (9x23), 9mm Short, aka 9mm Kurz (9x17, more commonly known as .380acp), 9x21 (Similar to .38 Super), 9mm Makarov (9x18), and others I don't remember right off the top of my head.

So trust me when I say when you buy a 9 millimeter pistol, be SURE it's really a 9 millimeter pistol. It should have the caliber stamped on the side and should say "9mm Luger" or "9mm P" or "9x19", and NOT "9mm Kurz" or "9mm Browning Short" - becuase those are .380acp.

The easiest way to tell (and unfortunately most gunshops get a little itchy when you talk about handling live ammo with a live weapon) is to field-strip the weapon and drop a live cartridge into the firing chamber (the barrel should be completely removed from the gun if possible, but at the very least, should be totally exposed with no slide on and no way for the weapon to fire in the disassembled state) it. If the flat tail-end of the cartridge is even with the rear of the barrel (it falls all the way in and is even), then you have a correct cartridge-to-gun fit. If you've chosen a box of 9mm luger/9x19/9mm Parabellum ammunition, you know you've got the right gun.

If the cartridge doesn't go all the way into the chamber, you have either a 9x18 or 9x17 gun, with 9x19 ammunition. This won't work.

If the cartridge goes in DEEPER than the back of the barrel, you've either chosen the wrong ammunition and you DO have a 9mm barrel, or, you have a 9x21 or 9x23 pistol. Either way, it ain't gonna work.

Hopefully, you'll get a gunshop representative who knows his ass from a hole in the ground and won't try to mislead you with all the different versions of 9mm in the attempt to make a sale. I've met up with some fucking asinine salespeople, and I've met up with some salesmen who are as honest as the day is long about guns.

And just as a side note, for my own amusement I go into gunshops where they don't know me and listen to their schpiel. I learn a lot from just listening to guys who think they're coaching a newbie and the errors they make in order to make a sale. I have weird ways of having fun. But I also know firsthand the wide variation in integrity in people who sell guns for a living.

Anyway, go with a 9x19 pistol. Even a cheap, crappy one. And by cheap and crappy I mean something that sells brand new for under 200 dollars.

However, that being said, it is in your best interest to purchase the best you can afford. Remember that this gun is going to be a piece of safety equipment that you are going to have to trust your life to in a time where your lifespan may be measured in seconds should it come down to its use. Do NOT skimp on this purchase. I'm not saying you have to purchase a top-of-the-line Sig Sauer or Heckler & Koch, but I'm saying that if you can afford a Ruger, don't buy a Hi-Point. There's a reason why guns are more expensive from the low-end to the middle-of-the-road. For the high-end stuff (police and military issue), it quickly becomes a personal-preference Ford vs. Chevy argument. Some guys like Beretta, others swear by Sig Sauer, Others by Glock. Some like Smith & Wesson...the point is, the name brands are expensive and if you can afford a name brand, go with the one you like best, they're pretty much all the same, give or take (I'm trying to leave my own Ford vs. Chevy opinion out of this) in terms of quality and workmanship. But the smaller off-brands you've probably never heard of (Like Hi-Point, Llama, etc.) can vary in quality and remember that you get what you pay for.

But as I like to say, "even a cheap gun is better than no gun."

Just understand that a cheap gun's shortcomings will be in weight, capacity, and reliability. Which means more likely to malfunction, heavier than more expensive pistols, and probably will hold fewer shots.

Now the WHY's of the 9 millimeter:

First off, it's the most prolific handgun cartridge on the planet. From the far east to the middle east to Africa to South America, militaries and police organizations are using or have used the 9mm Luger cartridge since its inception around 1908. Next to the cartridge your own police use, the 9mm will be the next easiest to scrounge ammunition for, all other factors being equal.

Now, I want you to make note that I'm not talking a bit about ballistics, or stopping power, or any of the other "usual" factors going into pistol choices that gun writers make their living debating and discussing; There's a reason for this: In a SHTF situation, nobody gives a rat's ass who used what ammo, who used what combat stance, who was trained better, or whether anyone had hollowpoints. The only thing YOU will care about is NOT DYING. And the only thing anyone else is going to give a shit about is WHO LIVED AND WHO DIED.

The whole point of having a gun is being able to fire bullets from it. You must have bullets in order to fire them. Ergo, before stopping power, before ballistics, comes the plain, simple fact that YOU MUST HAVE AMMUNITION FOR YOUR GUN TO GO BANG.

Without your gun going bang, you have an expensive club. Or worse, you have something people THINK will go bang, but won't. That's probably the most dangerous place to be, because when they call your bluff, you will be severely fucked. And they will kill you, or at the very least, maim you and take your weapon.

So, as an aside, if you're thinking of having a gun but not loading it, you're a fucking idiot and should stop reading now. You're wasting your time on wishful thinking because you've got an incomplete concept of reality. It is people like you who get killed and make the rest of the gun-owning population look like idiots. Go away.

If you're going to use the gun for a bluff - you deserve the outcome you get. Darwin would be proud. And in your last dying breaths, I want you to envision my face shouting at you, "STUPID!"

Enough on my tirade. Back to buying.

3) If even the least expensive 9mm doesn't appeal to you, it is perfectly acceptable to purchase another caliber, with your implicit understanding that ammunition availability will be the greatest of your concerns once the commercial channels become nonexistent.

What I'm saying is that there are other common calibers, such as .38 Special, .380acp (9mm Kurz, 9mm Browning Short), .32acp (7.65), even .22 Long Rifle.

Or even .45acp or a "Magnum" (Either .357 or .44, and if you don't physically know the difference, you probably should buy the .357 due to its versatility and less punishing recoil).

Oh yeah. "Recoil" is what we gun folks properly refer to that force that when you fire the gun, you feel in your hand. Not "Kickback" - Please stop using that word. You sound like such a fucking IGNORANT MORON when you do! It just screams "I am an ignorant fuck who knows nothing about guns. Please sell me some piece of shit, take my money, and laugh at me after I leave the shop! I'm a clueless rube!"

Seriously, if you find a better-quality firearm in a caliber other than the local police caliber or 9mm, you should consider buying it.

Also, don't be afraid to bring a knowledgeable person YOU TRUST to go shopping with you. Most of my friends either ARE knowledgeable, or they come to me when they go shopping, because not only do I know what I'm looking for and at, I know WHERE to go for the best deals.

That being said, many self-styled "Experts" are going to want to interject their own "Ford Vs. Chevy" opinions while you shop. THIS IS NOT THE PLACE FOR THEM. You don't really care about your FRIEND's preference for safety location (frame or slide, up or down?) or the trigger pull (I don't like traditional double action), or anything else SUBJECTIVE about the gun.

What you want to know is:

1) Does this firearm fit my hand? Can I fire it safely? Can I reach all the controls?
2) Is this firearm reliable? (This is a slippery question that quickly becomes Ford Vs. Chevy. The truth is that even with high-end guns, sometimes one slips through the Quality Control screen, and even a little burr of metal along an edge can be the difference between a death-and-taxes reliable gun, and a jam-o-matic.)
3) Will this firearm do what I want it to do?

#3 is especially important. It opens the door to the basic Wog test of Kit:
("Kit" in this case refers to basic personal survival gear.)

1) What does it do?
2) How well does it do it?

if you want, you can add a third:

3) Do I really need it?

Theoretically, if you're even considering 1 and 2, the answer to 3 is already Yes. If it isn't, you shouldn't even be considering 1 and 2.

So, with this in mind, let's apply it to guns.

What does a gun do? It fires projectiles. Bullets. It makes a loud noise every time it does this. It is a scary, deadly piece of equipment designed to project deadly force a distance away from the shooter. It is designed to kill people. Period. If you're not comfortable with the possibility of having to kill someone, it's not time for you to buy a gun. Don't buy one. If you're not sure if you would use it, you shouldn't have one. If you ARE sure (people who have been victims of a crime, if they survive it, generally find themselves changed to the point where, after being hit with reality, they are decisive about whether or not they can kill in self-defense), then a firearm is your best option.

I'm not going to discuss less-than-lethal equipment here. That's not the point. This is a gun-buying guide, not a personal protection seminar. There are plenty of other folks out there trying to sell you the latest greatest less-than-lethal ease-your-conscience-about-using-a-weapon-against-your-fellow-man equipment. Great. I could give a shit less. If you're drawing your gun in preparation for its use, you damn well better be ready to kill whoever you're pointing it at, or you're fucked.

And if you DON'T kill whoever you're pointing it at, you're also fucked.

Which means, if you're going to use a gun, you're pretty much fucked already, and using the gun just means you'll survive and be LESS fucked than being dead and being TOTALLY fucked. That's the bottom line with a firearm: It's the least awful of the options presented to you. If you have an option that does NOT involve your use of the firearm, you had damn well better be exercising that option instead of going to the gun. Because the gun really IS the Final Option in a confrontation. It is the acceptance that the confrontation has become lethal and that someone is going to die. Your use of the gun is merely your assertion that it will NOT be you.

Enough preaching. Back on subject. What does it do?

It's a gun. It fires bullets efficiently and effectively.

How well does it do it?

Heres where having your expert with you will help. He'll know what to look for (if he's worth a shit) and will be able to answer your questions (when the gunshop guy can't.).

If you HAD the time to take the gun to a range, or even GO to a range to try out different guns...you should take advantage of that time.

But this guide isn't for that situation. This is a quick-and-dirty guide to purchasing a gun under less-than-optimal conditions for the purpose of your own imminent personal protection, and as such you understand and realize there are certain risks and liabilities you take and accept as part of this process, whether you are fully aware of them or not. You are ultimately responsible for your own actions. This guide merely gives a few helpful tips as to firearm selection for SHTF if you have no other knowledge from which to draw.

I assume no liability for your use of this information.

This is for the one idiot who reads the whole thing, misunderstands it because the reading comprehension was the part in class where the daydreaming was occurring instead of learning, and some jackass who does something stupid is looking for someone to blame. I ain't it. I just give information; How you use it is entirely up to you.

So, to recap:

1) Buy a police gun.

If you can't buy a police gun,

2) Buy a 9mm pistol.

If you can't buy or don't want a 9mm pistol,

3) Buy a gun with the mental note that ammunition availability will be your largest concern.

And when purchasing a firearm under the #3 criteria:

1) What does it do?
2) How well does it do it?

That's it.

S